[Ruby] Righteous indignation (sic) and sensitivity

Tue May 22 14:16:57 PDT 2007

Apparently, I wasn't clear.

The issue here is not one of righteous indignation and its 
appropriateness as a response; neither is it a matter of my sensitivity 
or over-sensitivity.

The issue, as I see it, is whether the Seattle Ruby Brigade is willing 
enforce reasonable standards of conduct. More specifically, it is 
whether the group is willing to protect female and minority members from 
violent attacks.

This is not about me except insofar as I represent a demographic that 
the SRB would do well to attract. This is not about Mr. Vincent except 
insofar as his is a rather reprehensible example of the sort of conduct 
SRB would do well to eliminate.

In my mind, the important posts were not mine or Vincent's, but those of 
Messrs. Jewett and Serlin, reproduced below. I'll explain by responding 
to each here.

Corey Jewett wrote:
 > That's terribly disappointing -- that you'd write off one of the more
 > active RBs because of the actions of a few. This is an unmoderated
 > list. It's not like someone is sitting around holding everyone's
 > tongue in check for them . . .
 >
 > Guess the message didn't get through to the 'childish' among us. Of
 > course if you're that sensitive maybe you won't be missed. I'm sure
 > Ryan's occasional masterful use of the language rubs you the wrong
 > way too. ;)

If it is indeed disappointing that I'd write off "one of the more active 
RBs," then maybe it's worth investigating why I would. Consider that I 
am merely the vocal one among a group of many -- my peers -- who will 
write you off just as quickly, but will never bother to tell you so.

I took the liberty of reading Mr. Vincent's post, my response to him, 
and the responses I got to my co-workers -- a group of professionals, 
most of them Ph.D.s or Ph.D. candidates -- and their reaction was 
uniform: Vincent's post was disgusting, Jewett and Serlin's responses 
were pathetic, and why, exactly, are you wasting your time with these 
people? Most of them said, "I wouldn't even bother responding. I'd just 
write them off."

Wondering why your membership numbers are low?

The SRB list is indeed a moderated list because my posts have been held 
for moderator approval previously. But that is beside the point. 
Enforcing proper conduct should not be left to some sort of authority 
figure: that's a cop out. *Everyone* on this list has a stake in this, 
and when one member posts something as offensive as Mr. Vincent's post, 
there should be a torrent of disgust and disapprobation, and an 
outpouring of support for the victims of his diatribe.

In the absence of that, I can only conclude that there is no such 
outpouring because, on some level, Mr. Vincent is merely vocalizing what 
many of you feel, but are too smart to vocalize yourselves.

So much for the Seattle Ruby Brigade. If an unwillingness to suffer 
through sexist, racist, and (most likely) homophobic diatribes means 
that I won't be missed, then believe me, the feeling is mutual.

Ian Serlin wrote:
> I've been watching this list for a while now. I'm currently in Seattle for
> the summer (I'm based in LA) and found SRB through some of the cool podcasts
> you've done.
> 
> This group is what you make of it (or don't). You'll always run into people
> that rub you the wrong way no matter where you are. There's no reason to
> ever be satisfied with the status quo, but righteous indignation does
> nothing. Get off the high horses, all of you, and refocus on what this group
> is all about - a passion for one of the few things that makes our lives
> easier and more enjoyable: ruby (and rails).

Here is proof that this problem extends well beyond the SRB. "This group 
is what you make of it." What utter nonsense. The SRB is what the group 
makes of it. You can't say, "Yeah, I'm a mafioso, but I only go for the 
social interaction." What Mr. Serlin is advocating is the 
head-in-the-sand approach. Some people "rub you the wrong way," so just 
ignore them and get what you can for yourself, i.e. everyone for himself 
or herself.

Again, this is apparently -- judging from the lack of response on this 
list -- the view of most SRB members. Ignore it and it will go away. Or 
worse: that Mr. Vincent was indeed expressing the ugly view held by many 
of the SRB members secretly.

Mr. Vincent's post was an act of violence against women and blacks, and 
as such it demands immediate, vocal, and unequivocal condemnation by 
every moral human being who encounters it.

Women in our society are aware of the danger to themselves -- 
physically, emotionally, professionally, and in every other sense -- all 
day long every day. Every woman I know, and I know a great many, has to 
deal with this sort of objectification, trivialization of her 
intellectual capabilities, confounding of her physical attributes, her 
sexuality, and her willingness to act as a sexual toy for males with her 
worth, and violent physical attacks if she refuses to play along. This 
creates an environment that has devastating effects psychologically, 
emotionally, and, yes, physically for every woman.

Mr. Vincent *intended* to belittle women to keep them in their place and 
avoid the sort of interaction as equals that terrifies him. The silence 
of the great majority of list members on this issue, and the attempts of 
two posters to silence *me* instead of Mr. Vincent, is indicative of a 
serious and deeply rooted problem.

Ditto for the hyper-sexualization of black males (the "brutha[s]" who 
are "hung like a horse") -- a feature of white male patriarchy that has 
led to thousands of lynchings, the destruction of families, a 
hyperinflated black male prison population, and the disenfranchisement 
of millions.

These are problems with a long and ugly history, and they are 
exacerbated in the programming world -- one of the final bastions of 
white male supremacy, zealously guarded by a legion of insecure and 
socially inept white boys.

To call objecting to this sort of behavior getting on a "high horse" 
further trivializes the worth of women and minorities, and implies that 
indignation at  their mistreatment is not worth the interruption to what 
is *really* important: the discussion of "ruby (and rails)."

I find that attitude deeply disturbing.

IF THE SEATTLE RUBY BRIGADE IS REALLY SERIOUS ABOUT INCLUSIVENESS,
then I recommend that you call a meeting specifically to discuss this 
issue, that you use software to help schedule it so that as many people 
as possible can attend, and that you invite a professional moderator 
from a local women's group to give some perspective to the discussion. 
 From this meeting, develop a set of goals for the SRB re inclusiveness 
and an action plan to achieve those goals. Then act on them.

That is how professionals would handle it. SRB should expect nothing 
less from its members. I'd be happy to attend.

It is up to the members of this group whether you want to be taken 
seriously as professional programmers, or seen as a boys club for the 
incurably immature and insecure. Which is it?

Charles F. Munat
UWBRC

> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ruby-bounces at zenspider.com [mailto:ruby-bounces at zenspider.com] On
> Behalf Of Charles F. Munat
> Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 12:20 AM
> To: Seattle Ruby Brigade!
> Subject: Re: [Ruby] memcached-like Ruby+Erlang implementation
> 
> I was thinking about finally making time to attend a SRB meeting. This 
> post reminds me why I haven't. I have no time for such childishness, and 
> frankly I have no interest in being associated with people who think or 
> act this way.
> 
> I find this post deeply offensive, and I can't imagine why any woman 
> with an ounce of self-respect (or any man for that matter) would want to 
> be associated with a group that condoned this sort of talk.
> 
> Maybe next time.
> 
> Charles F. Munat
> Senior Programmer/Technical Director
> University of Washington Behavior Research Center
> 
> Daevid Vincent wrote:
>>> maybe some free training sessions.  
>>> kind like the one that dave thomas and crew do. 
>>> a one day thing where we assume nothing. 
>>> start at the beginning and crash course them  
>>> through to a working rails app by the end of the day. we 
>>> could rotate who's 'teaching' and have others roaming 
>>> around to help one on one.
>>>
>>> what do you think? anyone interested?
>> Why doesn't someone do that now for "all" genders you sexist pig! I'd
>> attend! :)
>>
>> Sure, just 'cause I'm hung like a race-horse you gotta be tryin' to
>> discriminate against a brutha. 
>>
>> Women already have _all_ the power. Trust me. We spend our entire lives
>> trying to find "the right one". They're in control, not us. Fucking
>> "Ladies Nights". Girls drink free. Girls get in free. We buy them drinks
>> and dinner all the time. We are always trying to impress them. Guys are
>> suckers.
>>
>> Ugh, don't get me started. 
>>
>> BTW, I have a super-cute model friend who lives in Spokane, and we were
>> talking about how her college classes were going, and she told me she's
>> taking a Ruby class. I was shocked. [a] that they even taught that as a
>> bona fide accredited class, [b] that it was the 101 class, and [c] that
>> she would sign-up for it! I was teasing her that all the boys must be
>> falling over themselves to help her and she just smiled, knowing that
>> was absolutely true. HAHA!
>>
>> *smirk*
>>
>> P.S. despite my jadedness, I do think it would be great if there were
>> more chicks in programming. I get tired of looking at dudes all day
>> long. Then again, they gotta at least be cute chicks, otherwise what's
>> the point. 
>>
>> :D
>>
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